The People Whisperer: Susan Levine’s Rise from Underachiever to CEO of Career Group Companies

Anthony Codispoti (00:00)
Welcome to another edition of the inspired stories podcast where leaders share their experiences so we can learn from their successes and be inspired by how they’ve overcome adversity. My name is Anthony Codaspote and today’s guest is Susan Levine, founder and CEO of career group companies, a nationally recognized women owned recruitment and advisory firm consistently named by Forbes as one of America’s best recruiting firms.

Founded in 1981, Career Group Companies has been transforming the career matchmaking process across industries like administrative, creative, fashion, events, and executive search. Susan’s leadership and dedication to creating meaningful career connections have earned her features in Forbes, Fortune, Business Insider, and Fast Company. She’s been named to Inc. Magazine’s Female Founders 200 list

and recognized as a best CEO for women on Comparably. Her commitment to creating a high touch, personalized approach has made career group companies a go-to resource for talent acquisition and professional development. Now, before we get into all that good stuff, today’s episode is brought to you by my company, Ad Back Benefits Agency, where we offer very specific and unique employee benefits.

that are both great for your team and fiscally optimized for your bottom line. Imagine being able to give your employees free access to doctors, therapists, and prescription medications in a way that actually puts more money in your staff’s pockets and the company’s too. As one example, a recent client with 450 employees boosted net profits over $412,000 a year, and it works really well for high turnover environments, seasonal and temporary workers too.

Results vary for each company and some organizations may not be eligible. To find out if your company qualifies, contact us today at adbackbenefits.com. All right, back to our guest today, founder and CEO of Career Group Companies, Susan Levine. Thanks for making the time to share your story today.

Susan Levine (02:12)
Thank you for inviting me to be on this fantastic podcast. And I’m excited to share so many things with you and all the listeners.

Anthony Codispoti (02:22)
Let’s jump right in then, Susan. So you started this business, am I correct, nearly 44 years ago? Where did that inspiration come from?

Susan Levine (02:31)
Well, it is almost 44 years. I can’t believe it. And the inspiration really came from falling into this industry ⁓ by luck and knowing that I sort of struck gold right away and loving the recruiting industry, but wanting to do something with a bigger vision that at that time there really weren’t any boutique high touch firms like career group companies. So I was very excited to

be able to put something like this together with my own standards and stamp.

Anthony Codispoti (03:06)
And so what does that mean, boutique and high touch, as it pertains to staffing?

Susan Levine (03:12)
Well, when I got into this business, they were mostly publicly traded, very, very large companies. There really wasn’t that hands-on experience. I think that I’ve always been a type A perfectionist, even when I didn’t know it. But I knew that I loved matchmaking. And I knew that just placing somebody in a job was not rewarding. It had to be placing somebody

in a role that they thought they could never have. And on the other side, reaching out to the leading companies and really promoting what I felt was my talent and being able to pair the two. it was matchmaking before matchmaking was really a thing. And that came from getting to know the talent very well and what they were looking for. And then reaching out to all these companies.

who I believed were frustrated and just settling on hiring anyone and assuring them that I was gonna be that new kid that came in and was really able to get someone their dream job and the company a perfect new employee.

Anthony Codispoti (04:28)
So I know that the services that you offer have evolved over time, as they should. Before we get to sort of what present day looks like, what did the core of the services look like when you first started back in 1981?

Susan Levine (04:43)
So when I started, ⁓ I really was an expert in administrative placement, both full-time and temp. And what that meant was any candidate that was, in those days it was called a secretary instead of an executive assistant. There’s been a real evolution here. But much of the job were the same responsibilities. So we were placing executive assistants, admin, reception. It could be any clerical job. It could be…

human resources, and so it was all administrative. There ⁓ was not as much opportunity, quite frankly, as there is today. And that is what put me on the map ⁓ as being an expert in that field and just simply focusing and going after all of the leading companies who had those needs, which was pretty much everybody.

Anthony Codispoti (05:36)
And so how did you get the very first customer? Do you remember that?

Susan Levine (05:39)
Of course I do. could tell you the name of the very first person I placed in at what company. ⁓ I worked really hard. You know, there’s no shortcuts. I was on the phone all day long. It’s an interesting story. Maybe we’ll table it for a little bit later about the challenges that I was faced with. But I cold called all day long. And I called every single company in Los Angeles.

who if I were that employee, I would wanna work for. So I think the important message here is that I knew I would be so passionate and do such great job for the company, as well as sourcing and finding the very best talent ⁓ for the kind of companies that I could relate to. And I worked really hard and I politely begged for an opportunity to…

show these companies that I was different and that I would stand out and that if they were not impressed with me and the level of service and the way that I worked, ⁓ I would never call them again. And ⁓ for me, know, so many people say no, ⁓ but who cares? I mean, they didn’t know me and I would say, you’re just saying no, because you don’t know me. But if you knew me,

you would definitely want me to be the person staffing your firm.

Anthony Codispoti (07:09)
And so who was the first person to say yes?

Susan Levine (07:12)
Caesar’s World.

They owned Caesar’s Palace in Las Vegas. This was the corporate office. I placed the chairman’s assistant and her name was Karen Kramer. And until that happened, I wasn’t even sure if this business worked. You know, it seemed too good to be true when I got the job because it wasn’t here. I started at another firm where I worked for 10 months and I felt it wasn’t the right.

Anthony Codispoti (07:16)
And what is is Caesar’s world? OK.

Susan Levine (07:45)
place for me to be able to do the level of work I want to do. But I did make that placement there.

Anthony Codispoti (07:51)
And so you were able to cut your teeth while working somewhere else. And you’re like, okay, something about this doesn’t feel like it’s the right place for me. I’m going to go and start my own thing. And that was after only 10 months of kind of being in the space.

Susan Levine (08:01)
Yeah, 10 months and

I must’ve been out of my mind because I truly did not know what I was doing. How could I know? mean, I was 24 and ⁓ I think I was always, well, I was kind of a daredevil. Like I thought, what’s the worst thing that can happen? We can talk about that later too because there was plenty of it. ⁓ But I knew I had to do something really meaningful.

Anthony Codispoti (08:06)
Yeah.

Sometimes that ignorance is bliss.

Yeah.

⁓ Okay.

So how has it evolved into today? mean, you’ve got multiple specialized divisions now, administrative, creative, fashion, big events. I feel like we could probably fill a few interviews with this, know, kind of following the evolution of your company, but kind of maybe give us the condensed version of how this has exploded over the past 40 years.

Susan Levine (09:02)
Well, I’m obsessed, number one, with what I do. You know, I have a really good balance in my life. ⁓ But from the day that I got into this business, ⁓ I have been very disciplined, ⁓ passionate, ⁓ like you can’t believe about the work that I do, ⁓ and have a lot of drive, and wanted to really make a big name.

⁓ in this industry, being authentic, transparent, ⁓ loving growth, because I’m not somebody that can sit still for a long time and be doing the same thing over and over. I’m really a promoter of growth, professional and personal growth. And so how do I describe having the DNA where it’s never enough? And more, more, more, more, more, more clients.

more talent, ⁓ and having the time of my life, by the way, building this company. And I say I’m the luckiest person in the world because while so many people have opted out to stay home, I get to come to work even as a CEO with my best friends every single day. And I wouldn’t miss that for anything. And so I built a company on that. And after LA, the next stop was San Francisco.

Silicon Valley, it’s an interesting story, but I’ll keep going. Then New York, ⁓ because one thing I want to say is when you have a vision and a dream, and I think that’s really what happened here, it’s not something where you’re ever going to take your foot off the pedal. You want to keep going and I want to perfect. I mean, I’ve been doing this for 44 years. I have a long runway.

I mean, I haven’t accomplished near the things that are on my bucket list to accomplish as a human being, as a professional, as a CEO, but I kept going. you know, the common thread of success in any business, but certainly my industry, I don’t think it’s a fluke that I wound up in the people industry.

I think my lot in life are people. love people. I love helping people. I love hearing people’s stories. love everything that a human being possesses. have a curiosity about. And Miami, you know, is a thriving big office. We launched in Texas, Greenwich, Connecticut, Orange County. We’re headed to Canada.

But these are all new challenges, but it’s all about great people. I always say I’m the people’s architect.

Anthony Codispoti (12:04)
So it’s interesting comment that you made with all of these accomplishments and we’re really just scratching the surface and what we’ve talked about so far. You still haven’t even come close to checking all of the items off your bucket list or accomplishing the things that you want in life. And I wanna hear more about that what’s on the list, but I think this is good for people to hear. ⁓

because I think, I’ve made this mistake a lot in my life and my career path is we always think that once I reach this goalpost, then I will have made it, right? Then I can slow down, then I’ll be comfortable, then I’ll be satisfied. And I don’t know, the most successful people that I’ve met is we’re always moving the goalpost. Like getting here just means, okay, now I can look further into the future.

And does this describe yourself as well?

Susan Levine (12:59)
my gosh, I’ll just share with you. I hadn’t even been in the business for a year. And I would set these crazy goals. I don’t even know where they came from, but it was going to be the most outlandish goal. But I thought, how fun to set a goal that’s not obtainable. No, how fun to set a goal that’s really a big goal. Well, I would have met that goal halfway through the month. Now the average person

We’d say I’m on a coast. For the rest of the month, I made my goal. I found it so easy that I said, now I’m really gonna take it up 10 notches. And a lot of the time I made that goal, a lot of the time I exceeded it, but even when I didn’t make that goal, it was still so much further ahead than the initial goal. I think that’s an athlete. I think that’s how athletes operate.

Anthony Codispoti (13:56)
So I’m curious to get your perspective on this because you you’ve said, Hey, I know people, I understand people. I know what they’re like, you know, very quickly. What is it that you think separates people that are wired the way that you are versus the person who if they hit their goal midway through the month is like, hey, now I can just coast I’m on easy street. Do you think it’s just the way that they were born?

Like you’re wired from birth with it. Is it something in upbringing or past experiences? Can it be coached? What are your what’s your thoughts on all this?

Susan Levine (14:34)
Well, I would say number one, if I had to pick a word to describe that individual, I would say drive.

somebody who has this crazy drive within them that just accelerates them to constantly be moving forward. Do I think you’re born with it? I think that there are a few components. ⁓ I had to have been born with a DNA that I call it later in life, we could talk about that, ⁓ would kick in, okay?

out of the gate when I was a kid, nobody would have ever said, she’s going to amount to something like, yeah, I was almost an underachiever. I think that is what motivated me to be an achiever, quite frankly. And so I think number one, as an adult drive absolute discipline.

Anthony Codispoti (15:22)
interesting. Okay.

Susan Levine (15:44)
focus and just failing was not an option. And so those are qualities that live inside of me. ⁓ No one had to tell me when I finally got into this business, get going. I was the one that was constantly hitting myself on the back saying, you need to do more, you need to be better, you need to exceed your goals. So it was an internal pressure all the time.

Can it be taught if you have the desire to be successful and if you are willing to make sacrifices and if you are someone that is not fooling yourself but you’re really willing to say, I don’t like this life I have anymore in terms of I’m not living up to my full potential. I could take that person and I believe that I could help develop them.

in bringing out those qualities and really getting them onto a really good positive path. So storytelling is great, but you need people who are willing to actually do the work because it’s hard work, but it’s so rewarding.

Anthony Codispoti (17:03)
So it’s interesting to hear you say that when you were younger, you would classify yourself as an underachiever. And you reached a point where you weren’t happy with that. You could sort of look at yourself objectively and say, I’m not meeting my potential. Am I understanding this part correctly? OK. So was there a catalyst, something that sort of like flipped a switch for you that was like, I am going to start doing things differently today?

Susan Levine (17:10)
Mm-hmm.

Definitely.

Yes or no? I didn’t know how to jumpstart myself. I just knew that until I was probably in my early 20s, I was very content with slacking. That didn’t feel like a loser then, because I felt like I was at an age where I could make excuses and it would still be okay. And then I got to a point where I really…

wanted to feel like a different person. I wanted to feel whole, that I could make choices in my life out of strength instead of weakness. That I was really had this burning drive to find something that I could be passionate about. But how do you know? I mean, until you’re doing it, you don’t even believe there’s that possibility. luck went into

an agency looking for a job and they described the role and it paid nothing. It was $3.35 an hour. That’s what minimum wage was. I thought, well, that’s more than nothing. And they described what this was. And I was scared in the beginning because you want to know something for people that are listening. You can tell yourself your whole life that you’re better than any job you’re doing.

and that you deserve more. But when the opportunity is put in front of you, it’s like showtime. Now you’re gonna really find out what you’re made of. I was gonna find out was I lazy and making excuses or was I going to be able to turn something into a really dynamic career, not a job, a career for myself. And that freaked me out.

⁓ that is what made me realize I have to be able to do this. I cannot fail at this. And so I worked so hard to be successful at something in a way that wasn’t even that hard. It’s called discipline. You have to show up every day and just do it. It doesn’t need to feel good in the beginning.

course it’s not going to feel good. You’re not successful yet. But if you don’t plant those seeds and you don’t show up and put on your game face and do what needs to be done, you’re not ever making it to the other side of the mountain. And the fear that I was going to have to quit this job or get fired and go back out there again and figure out what am I going to do is what made me really be so focused and successful.

Anthony Codispoti (20:29)
Were you a good student?

Susan Levine (20:31)
Nope. I was good at the subjects that I loved. I loved art. I was a fine arts major. I liked English because I always liked to write. But no, I was not a good student because I was a goofball.

Anthony Codispoti (20:52)
And so it took having a big girl job for you to kind of put on your big kid pants and say, okay, now I’m in the game. Now it’s time to stop being a goofball. Now I gotta get serious about this.

Susan Levine (21:08)
You know what it was, Anthony? I was always bored. I was bored in school and I was bored with every single job I had. I mean, people would tell me about the benefits when I would get a job and I thought to myself, it’s not gonna matter what the benefits are. I’m not gonna be here long enough to be eligible because I knew I’m not sticking around if I’m not happy. And…

Anthony Codispoti (21:34)
I think this is good. I’m glad that we’re hitting on this because I have a lot of conversations with folks, younger folks who are still trying to figure out what it is they’re doing, where they’re going. And a lot of times I hear that, well, this thing I’m doing now, it’s really hard. It shouldn’t be this hard. I’m kind of waiting for God or the universe to sort of deliver to me what the next thing is, what my passion is, what my joy is. And…

⁓ I think that’s great. Like if you find a job that you love, but sometimes you have to push through those really hard stages in the beginning, like you did where you didn’t know what you were doing. You’re cold calling. Everybody’s saying, no, you’ve got to get your reps in first before you find that success. And you, the wheels are sort of greased a little bit and it allows you to be more comfortable in what you’re doing. Like that doesn’t happen right out of the gate.

Susan Levine (22:28)
Nope. But that is a type of individual in my opinion. ⁓ I knew that I had to make this work. I can’t tell you why it was this instead of the job and advertising that I had had. I mean, I had a hundred jobs. I think with this, for me, I’m a storyteller. I want to

convince companies and people that they are in the best hands if they join me. And so when somebody would say no, was like, ⁓ you don’t mean that. You have never met me. If you meet me, you I’ll change your whole culture. You’ll let everybody go in your company and ask me to come in and be the person, the resource that’s going to give you outstanding people. Cause I think people hired

In those days a lot of mediocre people because they didn’t realize that there was someone like me that was my mission Who absolutely would go to the end of the earth to find them the best talent In los angeles because that’s where we were at the time And I delivered every time I had such high standards ⁓ That’s part of the

Anthony Codispoti (23:51)
What did it look

like back then, Susan, to find the workers to match with your clients? You know, today it’s, well, actually we’ll get to what it looks like today, but what was it like back then in the, in the eighties?

Susan Levine (24:05)
Well, let’s talk about the industry in the 80s. I think most people that got hired to do what I was doing didn’t have the standards that I had. And so if you’re someone that’s in charge of placing people at companies, and if somebody is just breathing and you think that they’re a superstar and that’s who you’re placing,

Well, lucky for the candidate that you believed in them, but ultimately that candidate also wouldn’t necessarily be thriving in that company and wouldn’t last there. I was somebody who always loved pleasing people and over delivering. And so there’s always been a huge workforce of people

who could be fine-tuned and helped and guided and mentored. And I do a lot of that for people who have a hard time finding a job. And I ultimately get them that dream job. But what it looked like in those days is that you had to go through hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of people to find that perfect match. And that is what I was promising these companies and the candidates. I will just tell you a very fast story.

My son was graduating high school and this woman ran up to me and said, do you remember me? And I said, I’m so sorry, I don’t. And she said, well, you took a chance on me. 30 years ago, I think it was more than 30, I came into your agency and told you I was days from living in my car. You said that’s not gonna happen. You picked up the phone and you called the human resources director at the Price is Right.

and you placed me and I was there for 15 years.

And so there are a lot of those kinds of stories where somebody couldn’t get a job, but all they needed was somebody that believed in them, that would use their context and get them an interview. After that, I can’t really do anything, but I’m going to open that door for you. And I’m going to tell them how highly I think of you.

Anthony Codispoti (26:29)
You open the door. Yeah, you help get him a seat at the table.

Yeah. So what did the, I imagine it was like putting ads in like the newspapers, like the one ads. Okay. And so people would call you, you’d schedule the interviews, you would bring people in and you would get a sense for, ⁓ okay, you’re a good fit for this. You’re a good fit for that. Let me set you up with an interview. that roughly, that’s how the process.

Susan Levine (26:43)
LA Times was it, that’s all.

Yes.

It did, and if there weren’t enough jobs for good people, I would send them out temping. And a lot of those temps got hired full-time.

Anthony Codispoti (27:11)
And so how would you characterize your business today in terms of, I don’t know, breakdown of temporary placements, direct to hire, ⁓ you know, professional recruiting, executive recruiting.

Susan Levine (27:26)
Well, number one, I think that the volume in temp is always going to be higher because you could have 25 new orders coming in a day from so many different companies throughout the country. So that’s volume where I want someone to start tomorrow. I need a maternity leave. I need this or that. As far as full time, ⁓ wow, people are blown away at how busy we are.

⁓ I have people say all the time, how do you have all this business? It pours in on a daily basis through referrals. Same for the events. We have a retained division, you know, where people pay you upfront to work on a search. ⁓ We have accounting and finance, creative and fashion, a lifestyle division, which is all celebrities.

high net worth individuals, estate managers, chefs, all, mean, that’s what’s so fun about this. No.

Anthony Codispoti (28:32)
The celebrities

are the clients and you’re trying to place workers with them. Okay.

Susan Levine (28:36)
Correct, and they

are A-list Academy Award ⁓ celebrities and producers and directors and people in the music industry. And you’re talking to them. I mean, that’s not who’s calling you, their business managers are. But then they’re like, no, they want to get on the phone. And they want to tell you exactly what they’re looking for themselves. ⁓ And that’s what’s so.

Anthony Codispoti (29:01)
Give us an example

of maybe one of the events that you’ve done.

Susan Levine (29:05)
⁓ Lollapalooza, Super Bowl. ⁓

Anthony Codispoti (29:08)
these are big event Super Bowl. Okay, these aren’t

like, ⁓ you know, Maggie and Tim’s wedding. This is okay.

Susan Levine (29:14)
No, these are massive

events, music festivals, activations, ⁓ pop-ups for celebrity clothing, ⁓ huge, know, MLB, NFL. ⁓ These are big events. We have a lot of NDAs that we signed, but a lot coming up in the future that are huge, ⁓ where we will have

5 to 7,000 individuals at that event. And we’re not producing the events, we’re doing the staffing. ⁓ But even those temp workers, whether they are busters or mobility, you’re pushing wheelchairs at an event, it really comes down to quality, good people.

Anthony Codispoti (30:07)
Yeah.

So how on earth do you begin to find 5,000 7,000 people in a specific geographic location for very short-term employment for something like the Super Bowl?

Susan Levine (30:26)
Well, number one, we use a lot of the same people for all of our events. ⁓ We treat the talent very well. ⁓ We generally pay more than a competitor would pay. I wanna give someone a reason to get out of bed and not wanna watch it at home, but actually work the event. A lot of word of mouth. ⁓

You know, remember Field of Dreams, if you build it, they will come. We have a really good reputation. People know they’re going to be treated well here. And, um, of course we’re going to advertise, but we have a very thorough credentialing and vetting system, but we’re doing fun stuff.

Anthony Codispoti (31:18)
I almost hesitate to ask this next question because you’ve got so many different divisions. I feel like it would be hard to answer, but I always like to give my guests an opportunity to explain who is their ideal customer.

Susan Levine (31:29)
Customer isn’t client or candidate.

Anthony Codispoti (31:32)
I love that question, ⁓ client.

Susan Levine (31:36)
Who’s my favorite client? I can’t mention a name. They’re all my favorite.

Anthony Codispoti (31:40)
Who’s your

ideal client? If somebody’s listening and they’re wondering like…

Susan Levine (31:44)
Sorry.

So my ideal client is someone that has a good company with a great infrastructure where they’re kind to their people. Let’s start with that. I think it’s really important that people have a chance to go work for firms that are invested in the talent, that care about their people. And believe me, we see everything.

So my favorite customer is someone that cares about their people, has a really healthy culture, where the people that work there are quality human beings, where you have a path and you’re creating a path and you’re interested in creating a path for people to grow and learn where there’s mentorship. Benefits of course, all those kinds of things are very, very important.

but also fun. mean, I want to work with fun clients and I want to work where there’s brand alignment, where I can relate because I’m going to be talking to people all day long. And if I don’t think you’re a good client politely, I am going to bag out from working with you.

Anthony Codispoti (33:06)
So I got to tell you what I love about that answer is in my mind, when I asked that question, I’m thinking, they are of this size, either in terms of headcount or dollar amount, or they’re in this geography or that industry. And that’s not where your head went at all. It was more like, what is the culture there? That’s what I want to know. Right.

Susan Levine (33:22)
Mm-mm.

Well,

culture is everything. So are people. So I have clients that have thousands of employees and I have clients that have eight. I don’t care. I care that the eight person company is growing to 12 or maybe they’re not growing at all, but they treat their people really well. I mean, at the end of the day, isn’t that what someone wants?

to feel valued. Yeah.

Anthony Codispoti (33:54)
⁓ absolutely. Yeah.

You know, Susan, what’s interesting to me is, because I get the chance to talk to a lot of people and it’s not, it’s not always the same person who has the set of skills to get a new idea off the ground, kind of through the startup phase. That would be the same person that continues to drive the company into the incredible phases of growth that you’ve seen.

typically different skill sets. Do you feel like you were uniquely suited for this, or were there mentors or other processes along the way that kind of helped get you ready for each of the stages of growth that would come over the four decades that you’ve been in charge there?

Susan Levine (34:45)
You know, this might sound like a terrible answer, but it’s the truth. I really didn’t have mentors. What I had were the lessons along the way of failing.

So every time we had a recession or every time there was a huge hiccup where I absolutely had no idea how to navigate around it because I was a kid in the early years, I had to really figure it out. ⁓ It all came back, it all circled back again to discipline and hard work.

and sort of crossing my fingers and saying, brother, I have to make it. I have to plug the holes in the boat with gum and get to the other side of the island, but I can’t go down. And you know, the pandemic, that was a new challenge that nobody saw coming. Very scary, but.

I’m not letting any outside emotion get in. I am just focused on making sure that the company and the people that work here, we are all okay. And so I go into a different head space and that is sort of like a surgeon doing everything to keep the patient alive, right? Everybody here relies on coming here every day and has to have a leader. ⁓

And there are a lot of very strong people here, by the way, who help pull their weight. But it’s being very focused and determined and disciplined and just making sure that you make it through tough times.

Anthony Codispoti (36:41)
So no mentors, any peer groups that maybe you’ve been a part of that have been helpful to you.

Susan Levine (36:50)
Well, I’m going to say the collaboration of the people here on a daily basis where we talk things through and we talk about where we are and where we want to go. And also we talked about vulnerability, you and I earlier. I don’t have all the answers. And I don’t feel badly about saying that. I mean, the day I have all the answers, I should retire, but

I look and I listen and I observe a lot of people and I hear things that people have to say and I’m very open to change as a CEO. Some people ⁓ feel like they know it all. How can you know it all?

bless you. ⁓ So, but I, there isn’t a person in my life. I mean, there’s so many different people that I know that I talk to that share stories at very successful firms. mean, far more successful than us. ⁓ And they share certain things with me and I really listen and I hold on to that. And it sort of becomes part of my mantra.

Anthony Codispoti (37:48)
Thank you.

Susan Levine (38:16)
and

I’m open to anything that I feel is going to make life better here for people.

Anthony Codispoti (38:26)
We kind of danced around this a little bit early in the interview. So I want to come back to it, to the question about serious challenge that you’ve overcome. Sounds like you were thinking about something kind of early in your career. Be curious to hear what it was, how’d you get through it, and what did you learn?

Susan Levine (38:45)
So this is actually a really great story because this was six months after I opened Career Group and I was 25 years old and had no business experience. I was so excited that I started my own firm and the recession hit. And I mean, it was like somebody turned the lights off and I had five or six employees and I didn’t have even the heart.

to say to them, you might need to go look for a job because I don’t even think we’re gonna make it. And I had to figure out how am I gonna make it? Nobody was paying fees. People were still hiring if they needed someone, but they certainly, you know, this is a luxury business and human resources is not writing a big check when you’re going through a terrible recession. And so I got very creative because again,

I cannot go out of business. So I would go to the LA Times and all those companies that I would call and sell our services to initially, I said, how much are you paying for your ad? And they’d say $378 or $149. Well, let’s say my placement fees in those days were two, three, $4,000. I called every person in the LA Times and said, kill the ad.

and pay me that money and I’m gonna fill your jobs. And so while the fees were tiny, I had hundreds of jobs.

Anthony Codispoti (40:18)
So basically you were making your

fee the equivalent of what the newspaper ad fee was. So really slashing your rates.

Susan Levine (40:24)
I just to stay in business.

Yep. I mean, slashing like 99 % off, but I needed enough money to pay my rent. And that was all I cared about is survival. So that’s another good word. ⁓ And I thought it was pretty creative that I did that. Not at the time, but now when I tell that to people, I probably wouldn’t be here today if I hadn’t done that.

Anthony Codispoti (40:52)
So that was enough to keep you afloat during those lean times.

Susan Levine (40:57)
And then I got all those clients as business and the economy shifted. ⁓ I had those clients that would have, I mean, right there in the ad, it said no agency calls. That never stopped me from calling. ⁓ But nobody in human resources wants to go through all those resumes if you have somebody that’s willing to basically do it for the same price.

Anthony Codispoti (41:23)
And so you were charging two to $4,000 for a placement at that time. People were paying three or 400 for a newspaper ad. You’re like, I’ll do it for that amount. you, you yank your ad. I’ll provide the service for the cost of the ad, which means you still had to run your own ads to get people in the door. And you had to pay your people to go through the lengthy process of interviewing and placing folks.

Susan Levine (41:33)
Yeah, any amount. were, yep.

Yes. Yes.

Anthony Codispoti (41:53)
And then

what did it look like sort of coming out of that, just keeping the lights on phase. And now I’m going to go back to those same clients that were paying me three or $400 and now say, okay, we need to readjust those rates so that they’re market equivalent to where they should be. How did you kind of make that transition?

Susan Levine (42:14)
Well, the interesting thing is it’s like altitude when you’re climbing. ⁓ I was so focused on my head down just surviving that one day I realized, ooh, I can take a breath. I mean, I was freaked. And one day I realized, ⁓ I mean, we’re making enough now where I can pay people and pay the rent and… ⁓

Those clients were feeling pretty good that they got extraordinary service. ⁓ I can’t tell you the percentage that said $3,000. We can’t afford that. So those people went back to their ads. ⁓ but I did gain a lot of business and my original clients, of course, ⁓ were happy to pay me what I was worth. mean, I was,

basically doing anything just to make it in business and people understood that I was worth more than I was charging and no one took advantage.

Anthony Codispoti (43:22)
I think this story is really interesting for a couple of reasons. I want to highlight, you know, for folks who are listening, like, yeah, that sounds tough. No, no, no. If you haven’t been through something like this where, you know, it’s one thing, most people have been through their own job transition career wise. And what am I going to do next? Where’s my next paycheck coming from? And that is very stressful. But now imagine that you’re in that same position, but you’re not only worried about where your own next paycheck is going to come from.

But you feel responsible for all of your employees and where their next paycheck is going to come from and how are they going to be able to pay their rent and how are they going to be able to feed and clothe their kids. And that puts just an added level of stress and pressure on yourself. So to push through that and then come up with this creative idea that you did, I’m curious, where did that come from? Did it just pop into your head? Yeah?

Susan Levine (44:17)
It did. It just

popped into my head. You know, uh, when you’re a business owner and you have leases, uh, in the best areas, best real estate throughout the country, you’re on the hook. So let’s start with that. Now you have during the dot com crash. That was number two, where again, overnight,

It went from juggling phones and filling insane volume orders to all of a sudden it’s pitch black in your office because your phones aren’t ringing other than collection calls you’re making. ⁓ I was responsible for all these people. And you know, there’s a woman that’s worked here for 33 years who says, number one,

I’m not a complainer. So when I’m going through these things, no one even knows that I’m completely panicked because I’m so focused on the solution to get through it that I’m not talking about how devastating times are. Hey, I’m a human being. Of course I’m scared, right? I’m not gonna project that. What I’m gonna project is that

I need to put my head down and I need to get us through this. And I have all these crazy analogies, but it’s like a pilot. you blow an engine, you’re responsible for three or 400 people. You have to figure out a way to land that plane safely. That’s all you should be caring about. Well, this is a big plane. I have a lot of people, 225 people and offices all over, and I need to get us to a safe place.

And ⁓ so I was telling you about this woman that came in one day and she said, if you ever want to be in a crisis, you want Susan Levine to be the person who’s flying the ship because there’s a lot of confidence in knowing that I will get us to a safe place. But that is, failure’s not an option.

Anthony Codispoti (46:37)
What’s your superpower, Susan?

Susan Levine (46:41)
about that or in life.

Anthony Codispoti (46:44)
in life.

in life, includes work.

Susan Levine (46:47)
Well.

My superpower. I think I’m a really good person. I’m authentic, I care. I’m genuinely interested in changing the direction of people’s lives who are stuck and not happy. ⁓

I love what I do and can’t get enough of it. Having a balance in life is really important, you know, I have a family. But my superpower is trying to help people be the best version of themselves, including me.

Anthony Codispoti (47:30)
And I get the sense that you’re very good at quickly is judging the right word, ⁓ recognizing what kind of person you’re talking to.

Susan Levine (47:42)
I can tell immediately. So that’s probably the superpower. ⁓ Having a compass and a chip where I just know people. How can I tell you where that came from? You know, I have this keen sense, even when someone else doesn’t believe in somebody, I will call a client and say, you said no to this person you saw the resume. You’re not hiring a resume.

You’re hiring a person. I met this person. This person belongs in your company. They fit your culture. You will love them. You trust me. Meet the person. I don’t think I’m wrong. And you know, I don’t want to say I’ve never been wrong because so much of it comes down to chemistry, but I had a client that refused to see somebody, a finance client, because the person came out of entertainment. I said, they’re doing the same work. It doesn’t matter.

This is your person. You told me what you want. This is your person. If I’m wrong, send them back. And they hired him. So I do have very strong feelings about people right away. Good and bad feelings.

Anthony Codispoti (49:03)
Was this something you feel like you had as a kid and a young adult or did it develop? No, this is something you, a knack you had early on.

Susan Levine (49:06)
Yeah.

No, know, somebody said to

me, this is funny, somebody said to me a couple of years ago, when did you get your voice? And this kind of goes hand in hand with what you’re saying. And I thought about it for a minute and I said, it was probably five. I was pretty outgoing and demonstrative. Yeah, I always had opinions. And so of course, as I was growing up,

Anthony Codispoti (49:31)
Five years old.

Susan Levine (49:40)
There wasn’t a superpower at seven or 10 or 12 or 18 until I tapped into this business where I could talk to people and then hear what they had to say. Hey, if the story doesn’t make sense, there’s usually a pretty good reason. Right? Like I do follow the truth and I do follow patterns when I meet with people. And if something doesn’t add up on top of my gut feeling,

I’m not going to ignore that. I’m not a transactional business person. really, I’m looking to place somebody great with a great firm. I’m not, the deal comes if you’re doing great work. It’s not chase the deal. Make sure that you have great people and great clients and that you are making really meaningful matches. I would have been a good matchmaker, right? I’m just doing it on the corporate side.

Anthony Codispoti (50:35)
I

was going to say you are a matchmaker.

Susan Levine (50:38)
I am a matchmaker.

Anthony Codispoti (50:40)
just not for the dating scene. So Susan, I’m curious, what are your views on AI and its role in the staffing industry? This is kind of a big topic of conversation in your field.

Susan Levine (50:52)
Mm-hmm.

Well, I think it’s how it’s used. I think it’s an incredible tool. think that we’re in it and we’re moving closer and closer to where it’s, when I say gonna take over, I have these debates in these conversations. I think that it is going to make everything much more efficient.

I would hate to believe that AI can actually replace human beings on a certain level. I think people are going to always need people. I can’t believe that companies one day are going to have robots, so to speak. But I think AI is critical. I think it will take a tremendous amount of work. ⁓

that people are having to do now themselves and streamline it, which will free up people’s time to have more time to do bigger, better work. But you know, when I read a letter now, I want you to know when somebody sends me a thank you note, I know is it from them or is it chat GBT? ⁓ Because if it’s too good to be true, it’s not from that candidate most likely.

Anthony Codispoti (52:13)
If it’s a little too polished. Yeah, there’s a there’s a tone. There’s a voice to. Yeah. Yeah.

Susan Levine (52:14)
You can just tell. I was gonna say the human element is missing, but

we will get to a point where people won’t care. It’ll just be about the efficiency of ⁓ placing hundreds of thousands of people. ⁓ I’m working on something now that I can’t really talk about, but where it will be a real value add.

for people who are lost in the shuffle that are looking for a job.

Anthony Codispoti (52:49)
You know, I share your sentiment that my hope is that as AI finds its way into more use cases and into more industries is that it’s used as a way to free us up from sort of the paperwork minutia that may be required and allows us to interact more as humans. And I’ll give you an example. My wife is a

speech therapist in a low income school district. And I hear her talk all the time about, you know, all these forms and these reports that, you know, she has to write. And I’m a little tech savvy. And so I’m like, you you guys, what if you could record the sessions and then have the AI turn a transcript into portion of the reports? And her eyes get real big and she’s like, yeah, we’re not allowed to do any of that.

And I’m like, yeah, I get it. they kind of, you know, especially in education, they move slow, but wouldn’t that be like the fantastic thing where she doesn’t have to spend an hour writing a report for a 15 minute session that she had with a kid. She can spend 45 minutes with the kid and 15 minutes kind of polishing up the AI report. Like, wouldn’t that be amazing? The kid gets so much more out of that.

Susan Levine (54:05)
Absolutely.

Anthony Codispoti (54:09)
And she does too, it’s much more fulfilling to spend the time with the child than it is the form.

Susan Levine (54:11)
Of course!

My fear though, and it might be generational, where are the young generation now gonna learn how to develop skills?

Right? mean, if everything is being done for you, where are you going to intellectually be challenged to do any of your own work? It’s going to get to a place where you push a button and it’ll pull you out of bed, dress you. They already have Waymo. You don’t even have to drive anymore. I I think that

Anthony Codispoti (54:31)
I hear that, yeah.

you

Susan Levine (54:59)
It’s going to be very interesting over the next two to five years to see what happens.

Anthony Codispoti (55:04)
I hear that completely and I tend to share the same concern with you. Here’s what another voice in my head is telling myself though, is that we heard similar arguments from ancient Greeks who were worried about the written word and people were gonna lose the ability to memorize things and to share stories. And we heard the same kind of thing about calculators and computers and

⁓ So, you know, over time, like has the way that we’ve used our brains changed? Yes.

I think what’s so startling is what a rapid and massive change we’re seeing with AI in terms of how we may end up using our brains. But if you were to sit here and say, hey, were the ancient Greeks right? Should we have not evolved the written word and books and the ability to capture stories that way? I think everybody would say, well, probably not. ⁓

Susan Levine (55:54)
Mm-hmm.

Anthony Codispoti (56:13)
But it is scary because this is unknown territory and it’s happening very quickly.

Susan Levine (56:19)
Well, who’s going to be doing the podcasts if works, if we’re extinct? Yeah. No, I, I, it, I, I.

Anthony Codispoti (56:22)
I hope you and I. Yeah. Maybe 10 years from

now it’ll be my avatar attacking to your avatar and they’ve both just been educated from listening to all the content we’ve already created.

Susan Levine (56:31)
Exactly.

So I want to become an AI expert. I want to know everything I can absolutely know about it. That’s a good challenge for me to take on.

Anthony Codispoti (56:45)
Is that one you decided in this moment or one you’ve been carrying for a while?

Susan Levine (56:47)
No, I’ve been thinking

about it for about the last six months that I can’t be ignorant about something that’s here now and really going to be prevalent in the future. I have to master that.

Anthony Codispoti (57:01)
I think that’s a healthy way to look at it. had a ⁓ former employee approach me a couple, two or three years ago, whenever it was, chat GPT kind of came into everybody’s lexicon and she’s a creative person, a copywriter, and she was worried about, you know, the future of her career path and just terrified that, you know, overnight, you know, the need for her services was going to go away. And I told her, said, you know, you need to kind of flip this around and

Think of this as a tool for leverage. And how can you use it to maximize the skill sets that you already have to deliver better services to your clients? And she went away for a couple of months and she came back very excited because now she had mastered it. She had rolled up her sleeves. She really figured a lot of it out. And she was so excited about now what she’s going to be able to do for her clients going forward. And it sounds like that’s the head space that you’re into.

Susan Levine (57:48)
Mm-hmm.

think so, and I’ll tell you, especially in creative, we’re very, very busy and growing. And these are areas that people could say these individuals could be replaced with AI, ⁓ but so far they’re not being.

Anthony Codispoti (58:16)
That’s fascinating to hear. And so when you say creative, the, me a little bit more of a picture. What kind of roles are these? ⁓

Susan Levine (58:24)
digital graphics, ⁓

copywriters, ⁓ production people. ⁓

Anthony Codispoti (58:33)
So that’s really fascinating because these are exactly the kinds of jobs that you’ve heard sort of the fear mongers say are gone or going away. And you’re saying, yeah, you’re still selling a lot of demand here. Okay, interesting. ⁓ What’s a resource that you might recommend for our audience? A podcast that you love, a book, a course, something that’s been really helpful to you, might be helpful to others.

Susan Levine (58:42)
No, they’re not gone. They’re not gone. It might be, but they’re not gone at this point.

Gosh, I wish I could tell you. know, Mel Robbins, well, I watch Netflix. ⁓ So you don’t wanna hear about what I watch. ⁓ It’s more other leaders and executives. ⁓ I know that Mel Robbins is super popular and she’s,

definitely an inspiring woman who talks about a hard past and how she has really.

helped a lot of people become very motivated and get out of their own way, but it’s more like a spiritual self-help book. I haven’t listened to a lot of podcasts that are relevant to, because I think it really comes down to what is it that somebody wants to achieve in their life? Are you going to watch, are you going to listen to a podcast because you don’t have a good love life?

Are you going to listen to a podcast because you are a lost individual and you’re stuck? You know, ⁓ I want to do a great podcast about, you know, are you stuck? I think everybody’s stuck somewhere in their life. I think everybody, if you really break it down and you say, is everything going the way I would like it to go?

in my life and is there room for me to be doing more? Maybe somebody’s a workaholic. I do make the time to do fun things. So, and I am a workaholic, but maybe there are people who work nonstop and their relationships are suffering or their kids feel like, aren’t my parents ever around? I think there’s a different topic for different people.

I think a universal topic is being happy, fulfilled, content, ⁓ living your dream. It sounds very idealistic, but I do believe that all of this is obtainable if you’re willing to take the steps and you care. think, you know, if you’re going 100 miles an hour, you probably missed that road sign. So I think

that the first step is being able to be honest with yourself, that you’re not where you want to be in your life. I think that’s a humbling, I did. You know, I wasn’t the person ⁓ then who I am today. It’s a journey and you have to really want to go on that journey and you have to be open and you have to ask for help.

And if not to the outside world, you have to talk to yourself a lot and say, why isn’t my life where I want it to be? And you have to be straight about it. And it’s sometimes really difficult to realize who you are.

Anthony Codispoti (1:02:25)
If you were to start your own podcast, Susan, what would you call it?

Susan Levine (1:02:31)
Well, I’ve thought about that. don’t have, ⁓ I mean, I have a lot of different names. I wanna be someone, I think I’m a good motivator. And I think that I am really authentic and genuine. ⁓

But I don’t think it can be a harsh title. I want to say that right off the bat. There are a lot of books out there that make it seem like you better get it together. You’re a mess. That’s not what I want to do. ⁓ No easy fix. How about that? Okay, it’s not cake batter where you add an egg and water and blend it and now you have the perfect cake. Everybody’s got a different story and a different journey.

Anthony Codispoti (1:03:13)
I like that.

Susan Levine (1:03:24)
The main thing is what is holding you back?

What is holding you back from being the person you want to be?

And I know somebody really well in my life who absolutely, and they’re near and dear to me, and they’re very defensive when I talk to them because they don’t want to be judged. It’s not judgment. It’s the reality is you’re lazy. Like you’re lazy. I see it. I used to be lazy.

This is what you need to do if you wanna get out of the lazy zone. You wanna make a lot of money, but you’re not willing to do the work to get there. You can’t get there, number one, if you’re not loving what you’re doing and you’re not fulfilled. I’m sorry, I don’t believe successful people who have acquired, let’s just say wealth, because today so much emphasis is put on success. Go on Instagram.

And you’ve seen these guys say, can I interview you? You’re a billionaire. How’d you become a billionaire? And they are. There is a common thread. There was no easy way to get there. You had to get out of bed every day, do a job that maybe at that moment was really hard where you were afraid. But the vision of constantly

seeing success out there in the future and wanting and willing to run towards it. So you can’t fool yourself. And by the way, not everybody needs to be successful in terms of money. Success can be defined in so many different ways. know, doing great work ⁓ where you’re not making a lot of money, but you’re making a big difference in the world and it’s very fulfilling. That is a very important

much needed job for humanity and you should be very proud of yourself if you’re that person. But then there are others who define success as an accumulation of wealth. And I mean, I can tell you for me, I love what I do. I love what I do. I’m obsessed with what I do. And I’m very fortunate that ⁓

It just is like the gift that keeps giving and I’m not talking about money. I’m talking about fulfillment of people recognizing the great work we do. So the name of the podcast, I don’t know. You need to help me. ⁓

Anthony Codispoti (1:06:15)
One

that kind of pops into my mind is, this is either the title or maybe even subtext for the title, ⁓ Getting Unstuck. That’s kind of what I feel like I’m hearing you talk about. Or Getting Moving, maybe that’s even better. Get Going, love it, more succinct is better. There’s one question I want to wrap up our interview with, Susan, but before I ask it, I want to give you a chance to tell people,

Susan Levine (1:06:30)
Get going, how about get going?

Get going.

Anthony Codispoti (1:06:44)
best way either to get in touch with you, ⁓ career group companies or to continue to follow your story. What would that be?

Susan Levine (1:06:53)
Well, Career Group Companies is our firm and I’m very accessible. People, you know, I’m here in LA, but 310-277-8188. I’m always happy to help people. You need to know that I’m always happy to help people.

You know, I don’t sit in an ivory tower. very approachable. And I love feeling like I changed someone’s life for the better and that I helped put them on a good path. And ⁓ I’m a good talker and I’m a good listener.

Anthony Codispoti (1:07:42)
So we’ll include a link to your website, is careergroupcompanies.com in the show notes. And if you like, one to the company and your personal LinkedIn profile. There’s a way for.

Susan Levine (1:07:53)
Yeah, and you know what

I want to know? I want to know how I can be a great help to people who are struggling and who are stuck. know, so I think that I think most people are stuck. Unless you’ve got it all figured out, you’re thinking about there’s got to be something better than this. How do I even begin? It’s daunting.

Anthony Codispoti (1:08:00)
Mm.

That’s, that’s a big give that you’re offering there. ⁓ it’s, it feels even more to me like the podcast ideas calling because, that would be a nice platform for you to be able to reach a lot of people. And actually that may be the answer to my final question, which is you and I reconnect a year from now, Susan, and you’re celebrating something, one thing, a big thing. What’s that thing that.

you hope to be celebrating one year from

Susan Levine (1:08:56)
great life. That may not be answer that you want, but it’s something. ⁓

continued success in all areas of my life, which is family, business, health, and feeling.

like, let’s talk about a goal, my podcast.

You know, a podcast, a self-help ⁓ where my journey ⁓ really empowered people to be able ⁓ to take some steps towards bettering their life, mentoring. ⁓ One thing I didn’t really say, I love teaching. I love being a mentor.

I love being a leader far more than running a company, so you know, okay? It’s more about feeling that somebody came in and is having a problem and they walked out of here with a solution. So that’s what makes me tick is being able to fix something.

Anthony Codispoti (1:10:12)
Love it. Susan Levine from Career Group Companies. I want to be the first to thank you for sharing both your time and your story with us today. I really appreciate it.

Susan Levine (1:10:21)
And I appreciate you for inviting me on. really mean it. Thank you.

Anthony Codispoti (1:10:26)
Folks, that’s a wrap on another episode of the Inspired Stories podcast. Thanks for learning with us today.